--- Topic for #oclug-board is Regular Board Meeting || http://oclug.on.ca/wiki/index.php/OCLUG% 20Board%20Agenda%3A%20Add%20an%20Item

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<WarrenLayton> Are we starting at 7?
<raj> yes
<WarrenLayton> How do you log your session in xchat? (other than the raw log)
<raj> thats the only way i know of..
<WarrenLayton> OK. Thanks raj.
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<Xenguy> greetz
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<vic> Woo. Quorum

scjody should be here in a little it too.
<Xenguy> vic: I told ya, piece of cake ;-)
<vic> Mmm. Cake
<raj> Xenguy: you can say 'i gnu it'

:)
<Xenguy> haha

raj: it's a gnu thing man
<raj> nah.. its been around forever now
* Xenguy whispers, my daughter's birthday was this weekend, there's still cake...
* raj reminds xenguy that he lives very close to his house now..
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<MikeKenzie> * Approve minutes of December 15 meeting.

* Review the action items from previous meeting(s)

* Speaker(s)

o Need a new meeting coordinator

o Speaker for February

o Speaker for March, and future...

* OCLUG volunteers for OSW

* OCLUG Knoppix for OSW

* OCLUG Website: Should we adopt ajh's new design? http://www.finux.org/oclug/

* Board elections

* dle: Removing the Beer item from the Newcomer Information page. I know. I'm a killjoy.

* dle: last minute entry -- the volunteering problem

* Budget for 2004

* linux-jobs

* links to other LUGS - Gatineau, CLUE, Kingston?
<Xenguy> raj: reminds? You never told me that - where?
<vic> Woo...saves me from looking @wiki. :)
<raj> just off parkdale near the parkway
<MikeKenzie> we've got a full list tonight
<vic> In navarre actually here yet?

And what about WarrenLayton?
<WarrenLayton> Here
<navarre> I'm here
<vic> Great. We have quroum. Might as well get started.
<Xenguy> raj: like the Queensway?
<raj> no, like the ottawa river parkway
<Xenguy> ah right
<vic> Xenguy: You're taking minutes, etc?
<Xenguy> vic: sure - I *think* I'm logging - if someone else could too that would be helpful

(log I mean)
* raj hands Xenguy a chainsaw
<Xenguy> We're in trouble here tonight
* Xenguy points at raj
<raj> i was only trying to help :(
<Xenguy> ;-)

so chairperson dude
<raj> okay.. so its7:03
<WarrenLayton> Xenguy: I will be logging too.
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: tx
<raj> wow. lots of firewood now
<vic> OK...Well, did everyone look at the minutes from Dec.? Any comments?
* Xenguy looks quickly...
<WarrenLayton> Absolutely beautiful...;-)
<navarre> looked fine to me
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: ;-)

I think I saw them way back when - fine with me
<raj> ditto
<vic> OK. Can we agree that we approve minutes of last meeting?
<MikeKenzie> OK with me
<vic> I say yes...

Beauty, eh!

OK...so...action items from last meeting.

We got our speaker for Jan, etc...that's good.
<WarrenLayton> What about Feb?
<Xenguy> vic: still need a feb speaker
<vic> No speaker for Feb yet (will discuss later)
<WarrenLayton> OK
<vic> We'll have to wait to hear from scjody if he worked on the knoppix at all.
<Xenguy> we didn't really discuss the 'beer' thing AFAIK
<vic> Did anyone talk to potential sponsors for knoppix? Not me....

Yeah, dle put the beer on the agenda.
<MikeKenzie> CLUE/LPI is a potntail sponsor
<vic> Hey...where is dle?
<Xenguy> hah
<vic> pot'n'tail? Woo!
<navarre> wow, he's like furniture here normally :)
<Xenguy> yeah didn't notice he was missing :p
<vic> OK. Well, we have one potential sponsor for knoppix....
<MikeKenzie> the event has also been pushed back a bit so there is more time
<vic> perhaps ajh/Steamballoon would be interested as well.

Yes...more time...but we shouldn't let it slide.

And the only other action item was to discuss the "beer" item...but I guess we'll do that later at this meeting anyway.
<MikeKenzie> election wiki page is in place
<WarrenLayton> ...we just need more candidates
<vic> Oh yes...saw that too. It was up before end of last meeting. :) Thanks WarrenLayton

Yeah...I will be perosnally asking certain people shortly.
<WarrenLayton> Thanks MikeKenzie :-)
<vic> I encourage everyone else to do so as well.
<MikeKenzie> We could draft people
* Xenguy dodges...
<vic> Force them at gunpoint to run. :)

OK...so...what's next....
<navarre> Ah, shotgun politics.
<Xenguy> hehe
<vic> 3) Speakers.

We need a meeting coordinator.
<MikeKenzie> we could resort to bribery we do have cash
<Xenguy> what is -> " Need a new meeting coordinator"
<WarrenLayton> vic: kyle is no longer meeting coordinator?
<vic> Kyle gave up the meeting coord. position.
<Xenguy> ahhh
<WarrenLayton> vic: Briefly, what does it involve?
<vic> Xenguy: We need someone to take the lead on finding speakers, making sure we have projectors, etc.

That's about it, really.
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: yeh, lining people up
<vic> And they don't even need to do all the work...just make sure it gets done by *somebody*.
* Xenguy wonders if OCLUG actually has any extroverts...
<vic> If a board member wants to do that, that's fine. But we can definitely make use of a non-board-member too.

OK....post your suggestions now of people that we can ask to take on this role.
<navarre> In that case, we might want to defer until we can ask the general population.
<vic> We can ask people individually too. We tend to have better success with that.
<WarrenLayton> vic: I can volunteer to do this.
<vic> WarrenLayton: That would be excellent.
<Xenguy> woohoo
<vic> Any objections to Warren doing this task?
<WarrenLayton> Where do we usually get our projectors?
<vic> MikeKenzie organized the last projector.

Bart also brought one from work recently.
<MikeKenzie> no one location, Nitro has offered but I couldn't get ahold of them last month
<WarrenLayton> OK. MikeKenzie, perhaps I'll talk to you about this shortly.
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<scjody> re
<vic> Great. So we've got a volunteers. Let's move on.

hi scjody.

Didn't miss much yet.

We just looked at old minutes, and WarrenLayton has offered to me out new meeting coordinator.
<Xenguy> s/me/be

s/out/our
<vic> Thanks. :)
<Xenguy> ;-)
<vic> On that note....we need a speaker for Feb.
<Xenguy> hrm
<WarrenLayton> vic: I guess Robert Love fell through, then?
<vic> It didn't really fall through yet....
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: good point
<vic> ...because we haven't agreed to bring him.
<WarrenLayton> What about MCR (I think he wanted to do a UML talk)
<vic> But perhaps it's not too late if we talk to ajh right away.

Yes...we should have someone local lined up, and maybe get Robert Love if we can.
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: I seem to recall that too

So do we want RL - I thought everyone was in favour (mostly?)

?
<navarre> Sounds cool to me. Adds credibility to the group.
<vic> Yes. I think there were no objections to RL.
<WarrenLayton> Xenguy: Me too.
<vic> If we can't get him for Feb, we should go for March.
* Xenguy aye's
<raj> what was the deal with RL again?
<MikeKenzie> Can we check asap so that we can get a local speaker if there is a delay
<vic> raj: Kernel hacker for ximian/novell. Works on getting kernel better suited for desktop use.

MikeKenzie: Yes, that's exactly what we should do.
<Xenguy> raj: it will cost $$$
<raj> so why were there any objections?

ah.. okay
<vic> WarrenLayton: Can you follow this up with ajh, and maybe get things rolling with MCR?
<Xenguy> raj: there weren't any objections AFAIK
<MikeKenzie> Novell might pick up the tab?
<vic> That's a possibility....
<scjody> Why would they?
<WarrenLayton> I kind of doubt it for a LUG meeting
<vic> Yeah...
<Xenguy> scjody: they want to buy us free beer
<vic> But you never know. I guess that would be for RL to try and figure out.

Should we set an upper-limit for the budget?
<raj> good idea
<Xenguy> vic: definitely - wasn't there a figure mentioned already (US$) ?
<MikeKenzie> I think 350 US was mentioned
<vic> Anyone remember the cost that ajh quoted?
<scjody> <ajh> Its from Florida so shouldn't be more than about $350 or so.
<vic> Yup.

That's US...so about $00 canadian.

err.

$500
<scjody> Wow! Free!
<vic> It's Linux!
<MikeKenzie> it may also increase the donations fo the night if we can promote it in time
<Xenguy> http://oclug.on.ca/archives/oclug-board/ 2004-January/005246.html

(that's one piece of the thread)
<vic> yes...we should push for bugger donations that night...and advertise the hell out oif it.

But before we get to talking about that....we should make sure we're actually getting RL.
<raj> k. so lets keep that as the upper limit (if its okay with the finances) and see if we can get sponsorships/contributions/whatever
<scjody> So let's say $600 as the limit.
* vic agrees with raj
<vic> Yeah...flight costs may fluctuate depending on time, etc....
<Xenguy> US$350 == ??
<MikeKenzie> OK
<vic> $600 may be reasonable.
<raj> Xenguy: $450 or so i believe
<Xenguy> OK so we're tacking on $150 ?

That's another third
<vic> Xenguy: Yeah..we can't be sure what a flight will cost until someone goies to pay for it.
<raj> $455.525 at today's rate
<vic> e.g....flights to Hamilton can be $69....or $399....
* Xenguy shrugs (as long as we know why we're doing it)
<MikeKenzie> ajh said he would cover accomodations
<vic> But ajh looked up a price when we were chatting, and $350 was what he found at the time. So it may be more, it may be less.

I wouldn't want to go much higher....
<navarre> unfortunately it tends to change from day to day
<vic> yup
<Xenguy> vic: agreed
<vic> OK...can we agree that we try to get RL, with a $600 budget limit?
<navarre> make sure the price includes security fees, etc...
<vic> yup
<Xenguy> yeah, no extra hidden costs
<vic> $600 *total* budget.
* Xenguy says aye
<navarre> agreed
<WarrenLayton> agreed
<MikeKenzie> And that's not taking the nights donations off
<vic> agreed
<navarre> how much can we hope to recoup?
<MikeKenzie> agreed
<scjody> If it's cheaper for March, do we want to do that instead? Assuming it's still the same to RML.
<MikeKenzie> we normally take about $100/night
<vic> scjody: Sure, doesn't amtter to me. Let's figure out when he's available or when he wants to come first.
<raj> march would give us more advertisement opportunity
<Xenguy> scjody: good point - let's go with cheap if timing is flexible
<vic> Yeah..want to try to push for March?
<navarre> not to mention, he's from Florida. Lets bring him up in March so he doesn't freeze to death. :)
<MikeKenzie> That will let us get it into Monitor
<Xenguy> heheh

vic: might as well
<WarrenLayton> and from what ajh said, Feb may not be feasible at this point
<Xenguy> why rush if we don't have too?
<vic> OK.

Anyone disagree?
* Xenguy drops a pin...
<WarrenLayton> not I
<navarre> hey, quite down there Xenguy

quiet even
<MikeKenzie> so MCR for Feb and RL for march
<Xenguy> sorry, sorry

sounds like a plan
* raj agrees
<vic> Sure, if we can get MCR. Need to get more people for Feb still too. But we'll work on that...

Alrgiht..are we ready to move on?
* Xenguy nods
<navarre> aye cap'n
<WarrenLayton> yep
<vic> Woo.
<MikeKenzie> OSW is now looking at March 27 for the event
<vic> OK...OCLUG voluteers for OSW.
<WarrenLayton> I can help man the OCLUG booth
<vic> I'm a little confused...what's the correct wiki page for *OCLUG* people to sign up?
<navarre> does osw have a homepage?
<raj> osw.ca
<MikeKenzie> the OCLUG page is for the OCLUG booth, the OSW page is for OSW, I have them both in the wiki
<vic> Is OCLUG doing out own thing on our wiki, or is everything going on on the OSW wiki?

OK

Well, we should make sure we have our stuff together for this....

Again...try to talk to other people to get them to help out.

So...what else were we suppose to talk about on this item?
<MikeKenzie> perl mongers have a few speakers

that's about it, just keep people thinking about it
<vic> Alright...anything else we should talk bout re: OSW volunteers?

going once...

twice...

sold.

OK...OCLUG Knoppix....

scjody?
<scjody> I haven't had time to work on it.
<vic> Fair enough.

Mike mentioned that he might have a sponsor for it if we get some printed
<scjody> Yeah, he mentioned that to me too.
<vic> OK. So we're still interested in doing this if we can get sponsors, etc, right?
<scjody> Nobody's said we aren't. There's still enough time to get them printed, assuming I can find some time, due to the OSW date change.
<MikeKenzie> I also haven't heard back from Healy disk, so we may need to find someone to print them
<vic> OK. Well, we should keep an eye on this and not let the deadline slip.

Any other comments about Knoppix?

I guess not.

Next item: OCLUG Website: Should we adopt ajh's new design? http://www.finux.org/oclug/
<Xenguy> point of clarification
<WarrenLayton> I prefer the old look, but ajh's navigation links (on the left hand side) are better organized.
<Xenguy> This is not a 'new design'...

this is a code upgrade...

i.e. from tables -> CSS
<WarrenLayton> Ah.
<MikeKenzie> my first reaction was what changed, but some of the content is new
<Xenguy> IMO
<vic> Right.
<navarre> Moving to CSS is fine with me. Doesn't look all that different, but CSS is easier to maintain.
<vic> I think it's a little better organized, and may make the maintenance easier.
<WarrenLayton> I like CSS, but let's try to make look a little less drab.
<scjody> He mentioned that he is up for suggestions on colours. The old ones were designed to match the ugly logo, which he removed (phew!)
<Xenguy> I think the move to CSS is the right idea...
<vic> ajh has tweaked the colours various ways...so that should be simple to do if we think it looks too drab
<WarrenLayton> vic: I know - it should be trivial.
<MikeKenzie> I'd fix the fonts
<navarre> I'll run it by my wife. She has a great eye.
<Xenguy> I think the look-n-feel right now is awful frankly
<scjody> Fix?
<navarre> I see nothing wrong with the fonts.
<Xenguy> I meant that the new look is a step backwards in terms of look-n-feel
<vic> The fonts look a wee bit small at work (1600x1200 at 19") but they're fine at home.
<WarrenLayton> How does the site look on various browsers (ie: IE)? I know some do CSS differently than others.
<vic> I think the big space at the top looks pretty empty...but perhaps the main content could get moved up.
<navarre> hang on...
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: it looks fine, except for Nav 4.x
<WarrenLayton> Xenguy: That's to be expected.
<vic> It works in Netscape 4.x,but is a little ugly.
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: yes
<scjody> vic: That was the original intent, but people objected to making such a large change from the original.

(the space at the top, not NS4)
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<navarre> the fonts dont' look as good in IE. They may need tweaking.
<Xenguy> navarre: the fonts should be sans-serif
<navarre> since we're preaching great stuff like _any browser_
<vic> Well, it *works* in any reasonable browser. Just doesn't necessarily look amazing in certain browsers.
<navarre> Xenguy: not sure. They're just not as nicely anti-aliased

I'll check mozilla on winblows too
<dle> is this the currectn site or the on-deck one?
<Xenguy> dle: ?
<WarrenLayton> navarre: firebird on Windows renders it fine, AFAIK
<vic> dle: ajh's
<navarre> WarrenLayton: Looks fine, but could look better is all. Looks great on my Fedora box here.

anywho
<dle> ah. fwiw, the current one render without ai here on Fb.
<vic> in my opinion, I think we should use it an tweak some of the way it looks.
<MikeKenzie> I just enlarged things and the text falls off the title bars
<navarre> I vote yes on a move to CSS, the details aren't that important here.

this should be handled by a web-dev team, no?
<dle> what's the motion?
<vic> There's no motion yet

Would anyone like to raise a motion? :)
<MikeKenzie> What will be involved with moving the old content over?
<navarre> I move that we adopt the CSS-based changes, details to be handled by a web-development team later.

this is too much detail for a board meeting
<dle> seconded
<WarrenLayton> navarre: aye (on both counts)
<MikeKenzie> aye
<dle> aye
<vic> aye
<scjody> For reference: http://modernduck.com/temp/newsite-winme .jpg
<vic> MikeKenzie: The old content is pretty much all right in the new design.
<scjody> Who will be on the web development team? That motion has too _little detail :)
<vic> Xenguy is a main web dude
<scjody> And yeah, this is stock win me, so no antialiasing.
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<navarre> I suppose anyone wanting to directly work on the oclug website.

under our fearless leader, Xenguy
<MikeKenzie> LEts put a call out the the membership and see if anyone is still interested
<scjody> So basically status quo then.
<dle> how so?
<vic> I maintain one section as well...the ExitCert stuff. I think if certain people take little parts, then things would be alright.

e.g...if WarrenLayton is our meeting coordinator, then he can maintain the meetings page.

Willy does the PGP stuff.
<scjody> dle: A totally unspecified team led by Xenguy. That's what we have now.
<vic> etc....

It's not *totally* unspecified. But we just need to define it a little better I think.
<dle> scjody: i see.

what we need is new volunteers.
<MikeKenzie> maybe put up a page for maintainers?
<WarrenLayton> dle: You're jumpin 3 points ahead in the agenda :-)
<vic> :)
<scjody> Well, ajh was trying to volunteer at one point and has, in fact, spent a large amount of time producing the finux.org page.
<navarre> I had planned to meet with Xenguy and maybe a couple of others in the near future to discuss setting up CVS and rsync.
<dle> nod. I think we have a 'go' for using the changes, yes?
<vic> Yes.

And I think ajh deserves a big "thank you" for putting it together.
<MikeKenzie> Maybe scheduale an ExitCertified seminar on making changes?
<navarre> once we have a process worked-out, that would be a great idea
<vic> But how many volunteers do we want / need for the website? Not that many, really....
<scjody> So we're going to delay indefinately until we have CVS, and/or a process?
<dle> all the pages should be coverd.
<Xenguy> Folks, I think I listened, and I've heard...
<vic> But if we have a large roup, then yeah, we could do a session...

No...I don't think we shoulddelay, scjody. I think we should implement changes soon.

We can set up CVS etc at any point....
<Xenguy> I think it would be best if I step aside and let new blood run...

It seems to me that is what is being asked for here.
<dle> i don't see that.
<vic> Nah...I haven't asked that at all.
* navarre scratches head
<WarrenLayton> Xenguy: That's not how I have interpreted it.
<Xenguy> OK, well maybe I took it the wrong way

But I have been thinking along these lines for some time now actually

I'd really like to be able to move things forward, rather than just maintain the site...
<vic> Xenguy: I think you've been doing a good job. We just need to make it easier to get other people involved, so that you're not stuck doing everything...and so updates can happen faster and easier.
<Xenguy> But I'm not sure I have the time/energy/motivation to do that.

vic: yeah, that's part of the issue, sure
<dle> yeah. me point re 'new volunteers' was a general one, applying to all of OCLUG.

in addition to being out-fo-turn.
<MikeKenzie> That's why we need to break things into small pieces
<vic> If people volunteer to do one small section of the site, and then we have a "main" webmaster do the layour, CSS, etc....things will be simple.
<navarre> most projects require a benevolent dictator for patches to flow through. IMHO, that's still you Xenguy
<dle> nod. 'penguin -n the middle" is a term I lke.
<navarre> otherwise, too many cooks in the kitchen
<vic> Yup.

No problem if there are any cooks in a big kitchen, as long as they're cooking their own stuff. :)
<Xenguy> navarre: OK, that's fine, but at the same time, there have been occasional suggestions that I'm trying to 'control' the site - I don't want that to be the case
<navarre> hmm.
<vic> I think that suggestion came about because it's been difficult for people to get involved.
<navarre> someone needs to through

though even

we just need an easy way for people to contribute, that's all.
<Xenguy> agreed
<vic> I think this will be good....let's just get it going.
<navarre> and version control to roll back boneheaded changes. For example, I make those. :)
<MikeKenzie> People still seem reluctant to create wiki pages
<Xenguy> MikeKenzie: well that part is wide-open at least
<MikeKenzie> exactly
<Xenguy> vic: we're still going to do CVS, yes? (my daughter's b-day is done now, so ... :-)
<vic> Yeah...let me know when.

Later this week is good.
<Xenguy> OK
<vic> ut anyway...let's move on to the next topic, unless anyone has any last words?
<MikeKenzie> so next meeting we will hace CVS and CSS?
<Xenguy> CVS definitely...
<vic> And we need to get a tarball of ajh's site.
<navarre> I'm also suggesting rsync, so changes to the production site are not made live.
<vic> Yup.
<Xenguy> I don't know about CSS - I'm just not sure right at the moment
<navarre> The lead developer can just "cvs update" a sandbox, test it, and if they're happy, push it out.
<Xenguy> If I'm not the guy, I'll let you all know of course
<vic> That's the pan.

plan
<Xenguy> navarre: yes
<WarrenLayton> next topic?
<vic> OK..can we move on?

Next topic: Board elections

We need volunteers to run this.
<dle> we need volunteers for the seats.
<Xenguy> vic: who's that fellow who usually helps?
<WarrenLayton> Hugh Campbell?
<vic> Ah...ummm...
<Xenguy> yes
<vic> Yes, that's it
<dle> yea

seriously, if we don't have candidates there's little point in finding people to run the election.
<vic> We need: Membership list, membership forms, ballots, ballot box, Person to run it/count (Hugh) anda second person to verify.
<dle> last, I looked there were 3.
<vic> We'll get the candidates....
<Xenguy> vic: I have membership forms
<MikeKenzie> we could prepare a bylaw amendment to reducd the size of the baord
<Xenguy> if need be
<vic> let's not do that until we really need to.

I think we'll get enough....
<MikeKenzie> It will take a few meetings of debate to get it worked out
<vic> It's still early. Nobody has really approached anyone about running yet either.
<dle> i have a note to the gen. list re volntring in the works. i'll mention the elections in it.
<WarrenLayton> dle: Can we have a look at it before it gets posted?
<vic> Can I suggest an action item: Someone on the board to work with Hugh to run the election....or at least get him rolling with it.

Or find someone else to do it, if he's not up to it.
<dle> WarrenLayton: i guess. i didn't intend it to be from the board, so to speak.
<WarrenLayton> dle: Ah, ok.
<dle> although it could be, if we want that.
<Xenguy> brb

back
<vic> OK...I might just volunteer myself to get some of this election stuff done.

I can recruit some people to run it, and make sure all the materials are there.

I can also pester people to run.
<dle> vic: pencil me in as an assistant. i'll try to firm that up in the next couple weeks.
<vic> dle: Sure.

I want to makesure the people actaully *running* the election are not board members though.
<dle> mm.
<vic> OK...so let's note that Vic and dle will get the election ball rolling.
<scjody> vic: It's more important that they not be _candidates_
<vic> yes, of course.
<MikeKenzie> we should also contact the auditor
<scjody> Who's not running again, out of curiosity?
<vic> It still might look a little odd if board members are running it...like having too much influence or something.
<Xenguy> yes, what is his name?
<WarrenLayton> Don Chiasson?
<vic> I'm definitely not running. Maybe again in a year....
<Xenguy> WarrenLayton: right (yer good!)
<vic> Yes, we need to contact Don.
<navarre> I won't be. I'd like to, but I have another kid coming and I can barely handle it now.
<WarrenLayton> last name might be spelled differently...
<dle> I may or may not. Depends on how the rest of the process shakes down.
<vic> I hink that spelling is correct.
<WarrenLayton> I will definitely be running.

and I would like some company!
<navarre> I'll run again in the future, but not this year.
<vic> I still want to do other stuff with OCLUG, but want to take a break from the board. I fully intent to be a volunteer.
<navarre> Yeah, I'll still be volunteering for talks and such.
<vic> Anyway....any more comments abou elections?
<WarrenLayton> not from me
<vic> ok...LET'S GO.

dle: YOu're up. Beer.
<dle> didn't we demolish this topic last meeting?
<Xenguy> speaking of which...
<vic> We didn't end up discussing it on the list.

But yeah....I'm not too excited to talk about it.

I think we should just wait for a new blurb to get posted to the list, and discuss it then.
<dle> oh. I thought i was to make some changes and get approval. haven't done so yet.
<navarre> there was an action to punt it to the list?
<dle> s/make/suggest
<vic> OK...Well, let's just continue that then....
<dle> okay.
<Xenguy> [dle: last minute entry -- the volunteering problem]

?
<dle> we ain't got none.

or almost none.

OCLUG will die without 'em.
<vic> dle: You seem to be the "volunteer dude" now. Do you want to take on the role of recruiting some people?
<Xenguy> there does seem to be a dirth of 'young blood'
<dle> sure.
<MikeKenzie> could we set up a mentoring program?
<dle> could you expand on that, MikeKenzie?
<MikeKenzie> A lot of stuff we need volunteers for takes some experience
<vic> We have some good new blood....orospakr, liquidnerd. They've been very enthusiastic.
<Xenguy> er, derth
<dle> dearth. :)
<MikeKenzie> we could take someone with interest and have them help
<vic> Darth.
<Xenguy> agghh
<dle> MikeKenzie, I'm not sure I know precisely what you mean. but of course some newcomers will require bringing along.
<MikeKenzie> another option is to document the process to death
<WarrenLayton> orospakr has been wanting to do a talk about Mono for a while. Why not encourage him to do a lightning talk?
<dle> sure.
<Xenguy> re orospakr: why not give him the limelight?
<dle> i think he's planned the 'big talk' for OSW.
<Xenguy> ahh
<dle> although that doesn';t preclude EC.
<WarrenLayton> electric circus?
<dle> for gen. meetings, a shorter talk wouild be more appropriate, I think.

Exit Certified.
<WarrenLayton> oops
<Xenguy> dle: do you have more brainwaves re: volunteering
<dle> item: we should officially pass a vote on ajh's bringing to town of whathisface.
<vic> dle: We did.
<dle> Xenguy: not right now. will communicate with the b. list.
<Xenguy> nod
<dle> vic: how did it go?
<vic> Yes, try to get him for Marc. Max $600cdn budget.

March.
<dle> okay.

er-- I mean. Outrageous!!! I protest!!!

;)
<vic> Too late. ;-)

OK...anything else about volunteers?
<dle> no. we need 'em, I'll try to get 'em.
<vic> Great

Alright. NExt item: 2004 Budget. MikeKenzie?
<MikeKenzie> I think this is more for the next board, but it would be nice to have some ideas first

We now have some cash in the bank, I think it's time to think about what we want to do with it rather than react to suggestions that come along
<dle> aside: Mike are you running again or intending to stay on as appointed treasurer?
<MikeKenzie> yup
<vic> I think Mike should run again. I don't like the idea of just appointing people so much. Even though I think Mike is the best person for the job.
<MikeKenzie> it would need a bylaw ammendment as well
<vic> Yup.
<dle> perhaps we had better make this another item, for another meeting if need be.
<vic> Are there any major budget concerns to worry about? Library is paid to end of th 2004 I think.

ExitCertified brings in money every month....

LITW....
<MikeKenzie> Everything looks good, I'd like ot get a GIC to cover us for a year to remove any temptation
<dle> i think Mike is suggesting we plan our expenditures proactively.

yar
<vic> I totalyl agree with MikeKenzie about putting some money aside.
<navarre> not to mention a little interest...
<dle> i'm a financial moron. i don't know what a GIC is.
<MikeKenzie> Guaranteed Investment Certificate
<vic> Guaranteed Income Certificate (I think)
<dle> that tells me little. :)
<navarre> very safe investment, with small, reliable returns
<vic> You put money in...get interest. No risk.
<dle> where does the money go?
<MikeKenzie> It''s like a savings account taht you promise not toi take your moeny from for a set term

usually T-bills and mortgages
<dle> Tbill?
<Xenguy> MikeKenzie: what's the typical return? (interest)
<WarrenLayton> perhaps we can move this discussion to later, post-meeting?
<navarre> treasury bill...?
<MikeKenzie> Treasurey bills - short term goverment bonds
<dle> okay.
<vic> yeah...details of what the bank does with it are off-topic. :)
<MikeKenzie> OK
<WarrenLayton> unless it's RBC funding SCO...
* WarrenLayton ducks
<vic> ha!
<dle> vic: not if it were like a mutual fund. i'd want to know which companies it was going to. but it isn't anyway.
<MikeKenzie> there may be some money made this week shorting SCOX
<vic> MikeKenzie: Can you come up with a proposal and post it to the list? Then we can vote on it and put some money aside. How does that sound?
<MikeKenzie> good
<Xenguy> yeah, I'm nodding off at this point
<vic> Xenguy: WAKE UP!!!
<Xenguy> ;-)
<vic> OK....only 2 more items...quick I think. :)
<Xenguy> we are coming up on 2 hours
* navarre sips his coffee
<vic> The proposed linux-jobs mailing list.
<WarrenLayton> no thanks
<vic> Xomments?

Comments?
<navarre> I dont' think there's enough volume to justify it.
<WarrenLayton> I'd rather just have the postings go to the main list
<MikeKenzie> Who would mederate the list?
<Xenguy> MikeKenzie: dave0
<dle> yeah. I can't see how it would help more than it would complicate.
<vic> daveo might be the obvious candiate.
<WarrenLayton> (unless it gets out of hand)
<vic> I have no problem with job postings going to our regular list. Wouldn't want to see resumes on the list too often tough....
<navarre> If we got a ton of these jobs emails, I'd say yes, but we don't.
<MikeKenzie> could we add the proposed tags to the Netiquett document?
<navarre> I don't think resumes on the list are appropriate.
<WarrenLayton> I like the idea that new lurkers on the main list could potentially see linux jobs being advertized there.

navarre: Agreed.
<vic> I don't think anybody reads the netiquette document. :)
<navarre> vic: Yeah, but we can point to it and go see? see?? :)
<MikeKenzie> Andrews list page sort of had it there n plain sight
<vic> Yup!

Yeah...I liked that part of ajh's redesign.
<MikeKenzie> and the irc help too
<vic> Yup.

But back top the topic of the linux-jobs list.... Is there anyone in favour of it?

I'm pretty indifferent myself....undecided.
<WarrenLayton> Not me - at this point.
<dle> nor I.
<Xenguy> I'm happy to give it a try, but I think it would take active promotion to work
<vic> Yeah.
<Xenguy> dave0 would have to do that I guess
<vic> I think we could create it, and get daveo to promote it.... Any jobs sent to the main list could get forwarded to the jobs list.

I wouldn't want to discourage job posts from the main list....
<Xenguy> there's no real harm creating it - if it flops, it flops
<vic> How's the newbie list coming along??
<dle> no one has really argued in its favour here. or elsewhere, the jobs list.
<MikeKenzie> that seems to be the consensus on the list
<dle> no one has said what good it might do.
<navarre> the newbie list is quiet, but we get occasional postings
<dle> or what it's for.
<Xenguy> well dave0 made his case, and some people responded
<dle> what was his case? ...
<scjody> dle: If we start a jobs list, think of the "discussion" we'll get on the main list next time someone posts a job there. Isn't that what we're here to do, as a board?
<vic> I thnk the job list would at least provide people a place to read/post job-related stuff if they don't have time to pay attention to the main list.
<Xenguy> I don't really care, other than I hate to see people unemployed - period.
<dle> scjody: I don't understand your point.
<Xenguy> scjody: nor I
<navarre> if I'm subscribed to oclug, will that automagickally subscribe me to oclug-jobs? I wouldn't want to miss job postings.
<Xenguy> navarre: no - KISS
<navarre> KISS implies we keep it all on oclug
<vic> The OCLUG-jobs list was also for resume posting. I wouldn't want to see that on OCLUG.
<Xenguy> that could be
<dle> dave0''s RFP really offers only resumes as an additional benefit, but is a mailing list the best way to share those? we'd be getter off having a jobs section on the website.
<Xenguy> dle: I can see problems with that...
<WarrenLayton> vic: Resume posting is a waste of time, IMHO.
<MikeKenzie> OTT.jobs is almost usless becaise to the headhunter spam
<scjody> WarrenLayton: I agree.
<Xenguy> dle: when Joe Blow's resume has been posted for 18 months ;-)
<MikeKenzie> daveO did mention a 3 month cut off
<navarre> Resume posting should be prohibited. If anyone is offering a job, they'll post, and those seeking can respond privately.
<dle> i don't think there's anything to vote on then. if even the one different thing in the RFP is controversial, we don't have a useful proposal.
<WarrenLayton> navarre: Yes. And that can be done just fine on the oclug list.
<dle> i suggest we send it back.
<Xenguy> we seem undecided
<navarre> WarrenLayton: agreed
<MikeKenzie> agreed
<vic> I think we sound pretty decided....
<dle> i say, let theose interested try agina if they want.
<vic> Yeah, let's send it back.
<dle> ahem, again.
<vic> Maybe if we get more demand from other people we can re-visit this.
<dle> nod
<Xenguy> what does 'send it back' mean then?
<dle> say that we can't vote on it because the proposal itself is too flimsy.
<MikeKenzie> we defferred the proposal to allow for further input from the membership
<Xenguy> OK
<navarre> action to update the nettiquette doc re: resume posting?
<MikeKenzie> and add the [JOB] tag
<navarre> yup
<vic> Did the resume come in with the [OT] tag?

If so....it's not a big deal if it happens occsaionally.
<dle> there was a resume?
<MikeKenzie> it was a link
<Xenguy> I think I'm cooked

that's 2 hours now
<WarrenLayton> yeah, let's move along
<vic> Yeah..he marked it OT.... I don't think we need to put more stuff in netquette about tags....

If we start doing that, we'll have tags for every damn post. :)
<dle> yeah
<MikeKenzie> gatineau was aded already, ca www.linux.ca be added as well
<vic> [KDE] blah blah
<dle> hah
<vic> [mutt] blah blah.. :)
<navarre> [gnomesucks] blah blah... :)
<vic> Does anyone object to adding links to those other lUGs? Certainly not I....
<dle> [fuck you] blah blah blah

not I.
<WarrenLayton> Perhaps links to nearby LUGs could replace some of the other links (*ahem* Slashdot)
<dle> hear hear.
<MikeKenzie> MLug and Kingston would be others to add
<vic> yeah...we can update the links at some point in the future...get some more relevent stuff up there....

But anyway, it appears we're in agreement over that agenda item.
<Xenguy> maybe post those to oclug-www? (that's what it's supposed to be for)
<vic> Good idea. Someone find those lionks and post 'em there.

Who can do that?
<MikeKenzie> I'll hunt them down in the morning
<vic> great
<Xenguy> alright
<vic> Alright...I think that's it. Anything else?

Oh...should we split the mailing list?

;-)
<Xenguy> grrr
* dle explodes.
<Xenguy> ;-)
<vic> haha
<navarre> lets allow *BSD content
* navarre ducks
<Xenguy> funny guy
<MikeKenzie> leave it for the election paltform
<Xenguy> let's include GNUwin on the CDs!
<vic> haha. good point, MikeKenzie :)
<dle> no BSE content though.
<vic> OK...I guess wer're all done.
<navarre> stick a fork in me, I'm done
<WarrenLayton> giddyup
<vic> Thanks....
<dle> gavel gavel
<MikeKenzie> night then
<dle> seeya
* Xenguy waves...
<vic> Later...
<dle> ----[]
<navarre> ciao

so leave already :)
<dle> you first. ;)
<WarrenLayton> no, you leave
* navarre snickers
<-- navarre (user2@ppp-216-106-110-142.storm.ca) has left #oclug-board
<vic> mmmm. Snickers.
<dle> not that we're going to talk aobut you once you've left or anything like that.